What do the Ijad look like?

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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby Zero Revenge » Sun Jun 24, 2012 11:26 am

Just thought of it now. If a Human/Ijad symbiotic pair were in combat... couldn't the Ijad flood the Human's body with endorphins & adrenaline for him/her to be super reactive?

I mean, I guess doing that too much would be medically bad for the Human host... but imagine the reaction time increase, and how invaluable that would be in the heat of battle.
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby Ced23Ric » Sun Jun 24, 2012 11:29 am

Zero Revenge wrote:Just thought of it now. If a Human/Ijad symbiotic pair were in combat... couldn't the Ijad flood the Human's body with endorphins & adrenaline for him/her to be super reactive?

I mean, I guess doing that too much would be medically bad for the Human host... but imagine the reaction time increase, and how invaluable that would be in the heat of battle.

There's constructive stress and destructive stress. Adrenaline eventually causes receptors to be flooded and stop relaying information ("fright freeze", deer in headlights) and other detrimental effects. Also, the Ijad, as far as I know, don't specifically alter your chemistry, but latch on to your consciousness.
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby gusindor » Sun Jun 24, 2012 12:56 pm

Ced23Ric wrote:
Zero Revenge wrote:Just thought of it now. If a Human/Ijad symbiotic pair were in combat... couldn't the Ijad flood the Human's body with endorphins & adrenaline for him/her to be super reactive?

I mean, I guess doing that too much would be medically bad for the Human host... but imagine the reaction time increase, and how invaluable that would be in the heat of battle.

There's constructive stress and destructive stress. Adrenaline eventually causes receptors to be flooded and stop relaying information ("fright freeze", deer in headlights) and other detrimental effects. Also, the Ijad, as far as I know, don't specifically alter your chemistry, but latch on to your consciousness.

What about splitting their focus between multiple foes? As in, the human fights the person in front of them while the Ijad keeps track of other enemies, strategy, that sort of thing?
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby Ced23Ric » Sun Jun 24, 2012 1:04 pm

Well, the Ijad uses the human's senses, so that'd be ... hard. :D
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby CalaveraJoe » Sun Jun 24, 2012 3:10 pm

Ced23Ric wrote:Also, the Ijad, as far as I know, don't specifically alter your chemistry, but latch on to your consciousness.


If I'm reading previous info on them, however, they would be able to get the hosts organism's body to release the chemicals, it's just that doing to, particularly without host consent (in the case of sentient hosts) is generally not kosher for them to do.
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby Joshua A.C. Newman » Tue Jun 26, 2012 8:55 am

Yeah, they can alter your neurochemistry, but more adrenaline is rarely what's needed in a fight. One of the things adrenaline does is shut down everything that you don't need to prevent you from getting eaten by a lion. For instance, rational thinking. Also, hair and nail growth, digestion, ovulation, and empathy. So, yeah, your senses get sharper, your ability to feel pain (that is, recognize when you're wounded) is diminished, and your reactions are quickened, but what you're going to do under those circumstances won't make much sense.

Acute adrenaline flushes are great. Long-term adrenaline soaking is very, very bad. It causes male baldness, sterility, heart disease and failure, reduction in body mass, and, well, you know: stress-related illnesses.

For interesting stuff about symbiosis/sex/parasitism/predation, check out Lynn Margulis. Tl;dr: the differences between those categories is pretty vague, and furthermore, much weirder than our language accounts for, like species that only have sex with other species.

For interesting stuff about stress among primates, check out Robert Sapolsky. Tl;dr: In social primates with no major predators (baboons and, implicitly, us), the primary threat to health is social structure and the stress-related disorders it causes.
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby Wadmaasi » Tue Jun 26, 2012 12:31 pm

gusindor wrote:
Wadmaasi wrote:I can't decide it if the two long ponytail-things in the picture of the "Ijad Human Female" (p.76 on the preview) are actual ponytails or some sort of Ijad antennae thing.

Could you link to the image?

It's in the rules preview that was released to Kickstarter backers, so I'm not sure if it's permissible to rehost it for general consumption at this point.
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby Ced23Ric » Tue Jun 26, 2012 12:51 pm

The link is stil llive.
Image Vesopia - An Ijad-controlled system, where SU and FC are still fighting.
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby Joshua A.C. Newman » Tue Jun 26, 2012 3:55 pm

I'm fully aware that my permission does little to affect the proliferation of digital files on the Internet.
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby Wadmaasi » Thu Jun 28, 2012 1:17 am

Joshua A.C. Newman wrote:I'm fully aware that my permission does little to affect the proliferation of digital files on the Internet.

I'm fully aware that people blaze down my street at 10+MPH over the limit despite there being a high school, middle school, and elementary school on it (not to mention a retirement community and who-knows-how-many residences), but that doesn't give me permission to abdicate my own personal responsibility.

Plus, it's hard to get all righteously sanctimonious at them if it makes me a hypocrite! =D
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby Joshua A.C. Newman » Thu Jun 28, 2012 9:55 am

If you download those files and that's the wrong thing to do, you're literally adding one download to 11,000.

In any event, the door is open. The only important thing to me is that the project backers get the first opportunity to get the files. I fully expect that, every time I post an update, a hundred backers show up before Tycho posts about it and then the horde arrives on his heels.
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby Mantisking » Fri Jun 29, 2012 9:19 am

<Propaganda>This is what people infected with Ijad move like. Be aware of the problem!</Propaganda>
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby Joshua A.C. Newman » Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:52 pm

It's true. They're good dancers.
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby XGundam05 » Sat Jun 30, 2012 12:15 am

Mantisking wrote:<Propaganda>This is what people infected with Ijad move like. Be aware of the problem!</Propaganda>

Someone point me at the nearest brain slug recruitment center :D
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby gusindor » Wed Jan 23, 2013 10:37 pm

Do the Ijad have any religious symbols or iconography? What about commandments and myths? I mean aside from the "can't touch it, can't rule it" thing. Also what about Ijad who don't follow that faith, or are there any? Can a human convert to Ijad-ism without hosting an Ijad?

P.S: Are the Ijad names meant to seem Arabic-ish or is that just me?
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby Joshua A.C. Newman » Wed Jan 23, 2013 11:44 pm

gusindor wrote:Do the Ijad have any religious symbols or iconography? What about commandments and myths? I mean aside from the "can't touch it, can't rule it" thing. Also what about Ijad who don't follow that faith, or are there any? Can a human convert to Ijad-ism without hosting an Ijad?

P.S: Are the Ijad names meant to seem Arabic-ish or is that just me?


They have writing. The word "Bhadal" is this concept they have that I've translated as "communal self-reliance".

One of their myths is in the book. They probably have lots of commandments locally, but Bhadal is the one they all agree on.

There are probably Ijad who have foresworn their religion, yeah. Soren had some fighting for the SU, but my memory is that it was coerced. It's definitely possible, though!

Humans can follow the religion without hosting, yes. Haski is an adherent in the Enniot City story. What makes a human a person — an Ijad — is agreeing to neither follow nor lead anyone but those they know personally. There are probably other requirements, too, depending on the local variant.

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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby Soren » Thu Jan 24, 2013 12:12 am

Joshua A.C. Newman wrote:There are probably Ijad who have foresworn their religion, yeah. Soren had some fighting for the SU, but my memory is that it was coerced. It's definitely possible, though!


No, it was by ethical conviction. She'd spent enough time around non-oppressive Unionists to realize that their society had some distinct advantages over her own. Ijad society is nice when it works, but involves a lot of low-intensity conflict and jockeying for power by design, and it can slide into warlordism pretty fast when things go bad. Ijad social mores are still adjusting to high technology, and lack a lot of important concepts - like 'noncombatant'.
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby Zero Revenge » Thu Jan 24, 2013 1:17 am

Joshua A.C. Newman wrote:There are probably Ijad who have foresworn their religion, yeah. Soren had some fighting for the SU, but my memory is that it was coerced. It's definitely possible, though!

Lies and slander, propaganda - all of it! ;)

Soren wrote:No, it was by ethical conviction. She'd spent enough time around non-oppressive Unionists to realize that their society had some distinct advantages over her own. Ijad society is nice when it works, but involves a lot of low-intensity conflict and jockeying for power by design, and it can slide into warlordism pretty fast when things go bad. Ijad social mores are still adjusting to high technology, and lack a lot of important concepts - like 'noncombatant'.

:o The Ijad don't grasp the concept of a noncombatant... in battle? O___o In what way? An extreme such as "If you're not with us, you're against us"? No concern for civilians [non-Ijad? Any? All?] caught in any possible crossfire? ...Taking hostages?
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby Soren » Thu Jan 24, 2013 1:48 am

The idea of civilians as distinct from fighting forces is a pretty recent one in human cultures, let alone in an alien one that doesn't have a concept of the nation-state. Ijad loyalties are personal and tribal - that has good and bad points. Feudal societies are run on personal and tribal loyalties. So are drug gangs. Reputation is everything, and laws, contracts, and customs are enforced by direct personal violence and the threat of violence.

Ijad have the host-symbiote separation, which means they can practice the same kind of violence on each other without killing each other permanently. Until recently, that was pretty easy to keep under control - pre-gunpowder societies have a hard time killing enough of each other off, and when you can slip into a new body, it's not really murder, is it? More like stealing a horse. Then humans showed up - hosts who are also people. That was just a giant monkey wrench in the gears in so many ways.

In the long run, Ijad culture and religion are going to change, whether they win the Protracted Struggle or not. Their social structure is too deeply out of sync with their technology - specifically, their ability to kill.
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Re: What do the Ijad look like?

Postby Zero Revenge » Thu Jan 24, 2013 3:15 am

Soren wrote:The idea of civilians as distinct from fighting forces is a pretty recent one in human cultures, let alone in an alien one that doesn't have a concept of the nation-state. Ijad loyalties are personal and tribal - that has good and bad points. Feudal societies are run on personal and tribal loyalties. So are drug gangs. Reputation is everything, and laws, contracts, and customs are enforced by direct personal violence and the threat of violence.

Oh... oh okay, mildly terrifying.

Soren wrote:Ijad have the host-symbiote separation, which means they can practice the same kind of violence on each other without killing each other permanently. Until recently, that was pretty easy to keep under control - pre-gunpowder societies have a hard time killing enough of each other off, and when you can slip into a new body, it's not really murder, is it? More like stealing a horse. Then humans showed up - hosts who are also people. That was just a giant monkey wrench in the gears in so many ways.

Oh. Holy Crap. I never thought of that. That's also mildly terrifying.
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